Steve's Rules with legendary executive recruiter Steve Nelson from the McCormick Group

Episodes

• Deborah Farone on How Women (and Men) Can Build Thriving Law PracticesMay 14, 2026 · 22 minSend us Fan Mail In this episode, I interview Deborah Farone, former Chief Marketing and Communications Officer at both Cravath and Debevoise, on her new book "Breaking Ground: How Successful Women Lawyers Build Thriving Practices." Among the topics: How Deborah is helping marketing professionals and law firms in her current consulting firm, Farone Advisors. The wide scope of her interviews for her book, including women rainmakers across the globe. Why the book is a great primer for everyone looking to expand their practices. Why women often fall victim to the "Imposter Syndrome". How artificial intelligence is revolutionizing law firm marketing and business development. Contact Steve McCormick GroupPlayPlay Deborah Farone on How Women (and Men) Can Build Thriving Law Practices
• A New Age of Partner Recruiting and Integration--An Interview with Chuck CurtisApr 8, 2026 · 20 minSend us Fan Mail In this episode of Steve's Rules, Chuck Curtis of CLCurtis31 Consulting and I discuss a myriad of issues relating to partner recruiting and integration. Chuck had a 25-year career working in high-level recruiting positions in law firms such as Pillsbury Winthrop and Latham & Watkins before starting his own consulting firm three years ago. Among the topics covered: The range of consulting services provided by Chuck to law firms, individual partners, and even legal recruiters. Determining early in the recruiting process whether there is a realistic compensation fit. The gap between originations and portability. The continued dominance in partner recruiting at the top 25 firms. Contact Steve McCormick GroupPlayPlay A New Age of Partner Recruiting and Integration--An Interview with Chuck Curtis
• Steve's Rules: Interview with Legal Strategist Wendy BerneroFeb 15, 2026 · 31 minSend us Fan Mail In this episode, I am joined by Law Firm Strategist Wendy Bernero, co-founder of Yate Collaborative, and a veteran of senior marketing and business development roles at many premier law firms. We discussed: The background and scope of Yate Collaborative. The evolution of legal marketing and business development over the past 30 years. Advice to legal professionals on how to position themselves for leadership positions in law firms. Our work for the College of Law Practice Management, including our joint editorship of the organization's newsletter, which summarizes major developments pertaining to the practice of law. Contact Steve McCormick GroupPlayPlay Steve's Rules: Interview with Legal Strategist Wendy Bernero
• The Emergence of Practice and Legal Project Management----A Discussion with Susan Lambreth of Law VisionDec 7, 2025 · 40 minSend us Fan Mail In the latest episode, I have a wide-ranging discussion with Susan Lambreth of LawVision, who is the nations leading authority on Practice Management in Law Firms. Among the topics we discuss are: What are most firms looking for when they retain her services Her various roundtables and what types of professionals are included in each. The importance of her certification programs. The evolution of practice management in the past 20 years. A summary of the various practice management models. Different structures encompassing practice management, legal project management, pricing, and other related disciplines. The emerging trend of Practice Group Directors transitioning to law firm COOs. Contact Steve McCormick GroupPlayPlay The Emergence of Practice and Legal Project Management----A Discussion with Susan Lambreth of Law Vision
• Interview with Jonathan Greenblatt, Co-Founder of Legal InnovatorsOct 1, 2025 · 31 minSend us Fan Mail In this episode, Steve interviews Jonathan Greenblatt, Co-Founder and Chair of Legal Innovators, which is changing the game when it comes to the recruitment of junior and mid level talent in the legal industry. Among the topics addressed are: Why the current system of recruiting and training junior associates is flawed; Legal Innovators' process for selecting law graduates; Why the firm's training program is superior to that of most law firms; The firm's record of transitioning its attorneys to full-time employment at client firms; The firm's separate Performance Coaching program; The firm's relatively new track featuring JAG Corps attorneys; How the current disruption affecting government lawyer is impacting Legal Innovators Contact Steve McCormick GroupPlayPlay Interview with Jonathan Greenblatt, Co-Founder of Legal Innovators
• Law Firm Partner Compensation---An Interview with Tim CorcoranAug 5, 2025 · 33 minSend us Fan Mail In this episode of Steve's Rules, Steve has a conversation with Tim Corcoran of the Corcoran Consultant Group, a leading consultant on law firm compensation. Among the topics discussed were: The primary issues that are leading firms to retain your services? The most frequent flaws in law firm compensation systems Balancing the contributions of rainmakers and key subject matter experts. How firms handle compensation of laterals, particularly in situations that those attorneys are not bringing all of their originated business to their new firms. How firms should design bonus programs for laterals Contact Steve McCormick GroupPlayPlay Law Firm Partner Compensation---An Interview with Tim Corcoran
• The Impact of the Trump Administration's Executive Orders on Law Firm RecruitingMay 27, 2025 · 16 minSend us Fan Mail The Trump Administration’s executive orders aimed at various law firms has resulted in the most significant issue that the country’s leading law firms have faced in recent memory. Some pundits in the mainstream media have even predicted the demise of the firms that settled with the Administration. In this episode of Steve’s Rules, Steve and his McCormick Group colleague Dave Ris provide some insights on the impact of these orders and the law firm responses, with a particular focus on lateral partner hiring. Subscribe Key topics covered in this episode: Immediate impact on law school, associate and partner recruiting. Which litigators might be affected How corporate clients might react Impact on the DC offices of the Wall Street and other elite firms that have settled Possible chasm between “transactional” and “litigation” firms How this may impact Government Relations practices in DC *Discussed in the podcast is Microsoft’s decision to drop one of the settling firms in shareholder litigation in Delaware. https://www.reuters.com/business/microsoft-swaps-law-firms-shareholder-case-hiring-trump-adversary-2025-05-01/ *In the conclusion, Steve attributed a Bette Davis quote to the movie “It Happened One Night.” In reality, it was from “All About Eve.” Contact Steve McCormick GroupPlayPlay The Impact of the Trump Administration's Executive Orders on Law Firm Recruiting
• Under the Trump Administration the Legal Landscape is Shifting—But So Are Your OpportunitiesFeb 6, 2025 · 24 minSend us Fan Mail While the current environment is chaotic, savvy government attorneys, particularly those with administrative law experience, may find this the perfect time to make a lateral move into law firm practice. In this episode of Steve’s Rules , we take a deep dive into the legal market implications of the new Trump administration—particularly the regulatory shifts, enforcement priorities, and job market changes that will impact law firms and lawyers. From antitrust enforcement and white-collar crime investigations to the rise of administrative law battles and state-level regulations, we break down how law firms and legal professionals can navigate this evolving landscape. We also touch on an important new resource: Steve and his team at The McCormick Group are launching a Legal Management Transitions Tracker , a monthly trend report on key Director and C-level hires and promotions in the legal sector. If you are a law firm leader or legal recruiter, this is a must-have resource for staying ahead. Subscribe . Key Topics Covered in This Episode: How the Trump administration’s regulatory approach is reshaping law firm opportunities Why antitrust enforcement is shifting—but not disappearing The evolving role of white-collar investigations and corporate oversight How administrative law is becoming a critical battleground* The rise of state-level legal battles amid federal deregulation Essential career strategies for government attorneys moving into private practice The importance of building a digital presence for job seekers and legal professionals And make sure you listen long enough the hear some spot on observational humor from Steve wearing his stand up comic hat. * In our discussion of the impact on administrative law related to "Chevron" we were referring to Loper Bright Enterprises v. Raimondo , 603 U.S. 369 (2024). In this landmark decision, the Court overruled the Chevron doctrine, which had previously mandated judicial deference to federal agencies' interpretations of ambiguous statutes. The Court held that such deference was incompatible with the judiciary's duty to interpret the law. Contact Steve McCormick GroupPlayPlay Under the Trump Administration the Legal Landscape is Shifting—But So Are Your Opportunities
• Steve and Murray go deep with American Lawyer's Patrick FullerNov 20, 2024 · 56 minSend us Fan Mail Get ready to uncover the dynamic shifts in the legal landscape with our esteemed guest, Patrick Fuller, Chief Strategist for American Lawyer Media. First, we discussed the ripple effects of recent elections on antitrust, international trade, and white-collar investigations, and even in mergers and acquisitions. Then Patrick provides a deep dive into the data that is being produced by ALM regarding law firm profitability and growth, dispelling some misconceptions about what are the signs of law firm health. Here are some of the highlights: PPL Over PPEP Patrick breaks down why Profit Per Lawyer (PPL) is a better indicator of a firm’s financial health than the traditional Profit Per Equity Partner (PPEP). It’s not just about the big numbers—tracking PPL alongside headcount and inflation gives a more realistic picture of growth and success. A New Wave of Legal Leadership With younger leaders stepping into corporate legal roles, expectations are changing. Law firms need to adjust how they build relationships and deliver services to keep up with these fresh perspectives. Succession Planning is a Must Planning for leadership transitions and addressing underperformance in senior partners is something many firms are still figuring out. Patrick and the team dig into why this is such a critical—and often overlooked—area for long-term success. The Buzz Around Lateral Hiring Steve shares insights on the hot topic of lateral hires, especially from government roles. He explains why it’s important to look beyond just the skills on paper and think about whether these hires are ready to rebuild their client relationships. Making Clients Stickier The group talks about how firms are focusing on institutionalizing client relationships. It’s all about making clients feel connected to the firm, not just an individual partner, to reduce risk and improve stability. This episode is packed with practical insights and real-world examples for senior law firm leaders looking to stay ahead in a fast-changing market. A big thanks to Pat Fuller for joining us and sharing his knowledge. Contact Steve McCormick GroupPlayPlay Steve and Murray go deep with American Lawyer's Patrick Fuller
• Executive Recruiting AgreementsOct 17, 2024 · 35 minSend us Fan Mail In this episode of Steve's Rules , podcast partners Murray Coffey founder and principal of M Coffey and executive recruiter Steve Nelson from The McCormick Group discuss some of Steve's market updates and then go deep on best practices in legal recruiting agreements.. This episode should be of special interest to those on the law firm side responsible for engaging executive recruiters for lateral placements. Key Topics: Increased Government Hiring by Law Firms Steve highlights the recent surge in law firms hiring from key government agencies, including the DOJ, SEC, and FTC. This trend reflects law firms’ increasing need for regulatory expertise, especially amid policy shifts and anticipated changes from upcoming elections. Steve explains how this affects the demand for experienced attorneys from federal agencies. Employee Benefits Partner Hiring Report Steve shares insights from McCormick Group’s new report on ERISA and employee benefits partner hiring. As mergers and acquisitions increase, firms are turning to highly specialized attorneys in this technical area to support complex deal structures. Steve discusses why these roles, though not profit centers, are crucial client retention tools.. The "Poison Pill" Clauses in Law Firm Recruiting Agreements Steve discusses three key “poison pill” provisions in partner recruiting agreements that can make firms less attractive to recruiters and dissuade them from bringing top talent forward: Fee Caps for Large Groups : Some firms impose strict fee caps on large group hires, which can be problematic if they aren’t consistent with the market for securing these high-value placements. Guarantee Periods and Conflicts : Onerous refund requirements, particularly when partners are forced to leave due to unanticipated conflicts, put undue burden on recruiters making placements less appealing. Non-Recruit Clauses : Blanket restrictions on recruiting, particularly not tied to placements, can limit long-term partnerships with recruiting firms. Steve emphasizes that balanced, reasonable agreements foster stronger recruiter-firm relationships and ensure access to the best talent. Bonus Content: Here is a link Steve referenced to the documentary film about his friend and fellow Key West, Florida stand-up comedian Tom Dustin: Portrait of a Comedian Contact Steve McCormick GroupPlayPlay Executive Recruiting Agreements
• The Career Road Less Taken: Pricing Professional to Chief Operating OfficerAug 30, 2024 · 25 minSend us Fan Mail Join us on this episode of Steve’s Rules, where Steve Nelson, Executive Principal at McCormick Group, dives into the evolving roles within law firms, particularly focusing on the rise of professional staff in key leadership positions. We explore the recent trend of hiring COOs from non-traditional backgrounds, such as legal operations, and what this means for the future of law firm management. Whether you're a law firm leader, legal operations professional, or just interested in the business side of law, this episode offers invaluable insights into what’s next for the industry. We will also hear from Steve about what is going on in Washington DC and Texas two of the countries hottest lateral partner markets. Contact Steve McCormick GroupPlayPlay The Career Road Less Taken: Pricing Professional to Chief Operating Officer
• Two legal recruiters walk into a bar...don't be the punchlineJun 23, 2024 · 45 minSend us Fan Mail In this episode, Murray Coffey and Steve Nelson delve into the intricacies of legal recruiting, offering a blend of practical advice and personal anecdotes. They discuss the best ways to manage recruiter inquiries, key considerations for those contemplating a career move, and the importance of building solid relationships with reputable recruiters. Additionally, they cover current market trends and emphasize the significance of carefully evaluating counteroffers. This episode is designed to equip you with the insights needed to navigate your legal career with confidence. Episode Highlights: Best Practices for Managing Recruiter Inquiries : Learn how to effectively handle calls and messages from recruiters. Controlling Your Identity : Safeguard your resume and personal information by only sending them to authorized firms. Importance of Ethics in Recruiting : Recognize and avoid unethical practices by some recruiters. Candidate Preparation : Ensure you have your statistics and relevant information ready before engaging with a recruiter. Choosing the Right Recruiter : Identify recruiters who have strong relationships with hiring firms and understand your market and practice area. Working with One Recruiter : Build a strong, trusting relationship with a single recruiter to increase your chances of successful placement. Personal Relationships and Referrals : Use your network to get referrals for reputable recruiters. Recruiter Methodology : Understand the recruiter’s approach and ensure they can effectively reach suitable firms. Assessing Opportunities : Utilize a recruiter’s expertise to determine if a move is in your best interest. Long-term Relationships : Work with recruiters who are committed to your career growth and provide honest assessments. Evaluating Offers : Be cautious with counteroffers and consider their long-term implications. Market Trends and Insights : Stay updated on the latest trends and dynamics in the recruiting market. Key Takeaways: Be Prepared : Have your market statistics and relevant data ready when engaging with a recruiter. Ask the Right Questions : Ensure the recruiter has a genuine relationship with the hiring firm and understands your needs. Control Your Identity : Avoid having your resume sent to multiple firms without your consent. Work with One Recruiter : Develop a strong, trusting relationship with a single recruiter for better results. Evaluate Offers Carefully : Consider the long-term implications of counteroffers and trust the insights of experienced recruiters. Join Murray and Steve as they share valuable iPlayPlay Two legal recruiters walk into a bar...don't be the punchline
• Episode Three: Plan on itMay 10, 2024 · 27 minSend us Fan Mail Overview: This episode provides a deep dive into the essentials of business planning for attorneys considering lateral moves. Steve Nelson leverages his extensive experience in legal recruitment to guide listeners on crafting high impact business plans that align with market trends and firm expectations. This episode may be our most practical and actionable let. We even have Steve’s business plan templates in our show notes. Key Insights: Business Plan Importance: Detailed discussion on the necessity of a business plan for lawyers aiming to move laterally. Components of a Strong Business Plan: Steve outlines the critical elements that should be included in a business plan, such as market analysis, client needs assessment, and personal value proposition. Strategies for Differentiation: Tips on how attorneys can set themselves apart in their business plans by linking their unique experiences to the needs of potential firms. Episode Highlights: Crafting the Business Plan: Steps for developing a plan that addresses both the current landscape and future market opportunities, focusing on the lawyer’s role in navigating these changes. Demonstrating Market Knowledge: The importance of showing deep understanding of regulatory trends and how they affect potential clients. Networking and Resources: How to effectively utilize existing networks and resources to bolster the business plan’s effectiveness. Bonus: Steve gives us his analysis of the lateral recruiting market in the the nation’s capital (hint: it is an election year.) Business Plan Template Option One Business Plan Template Option Two Business Plan Template Option Three Contact Steve McCormick GroupPlayPlay Episode Three: Plan on it
• Season Two, Episode Two of Steve's Rules: Making BankMar 25, 2024 · 30 minSend us Fan Mail The decision to pursue other opportunities is multilayered with no one consideration being more important than the other. Yet compensation often is a driver. But most professionals including lateral partners at law firms don't do a deep enough dive on a target firm's compensation structure. Each firm approaches compensation differently. Which means it is incumbent on the candidate to know what is important to them and to ask the right questions. So to, firms need to be as forthcoming as possible about the compensation structure. Steve knows the ins and outs of compensation systems based on his decades of experience. Have a listen and if you have more questions, please contact Steve at snelson@tmg-dc.com . Mention Steve's Rules when you call and get a prize. We mean it. Contact Steve McCormick GroupPlayPlay Season Two, Episode Two of Steve's Rules: Making Bank
• Listen to Top Executive Recruiters Share How to Turn Government Service Into a Career As a Government Relations ProfessionalFeb 12, 2024 · 31 minSend us Fan Mail Leveraging government service into a lucrative career in government relations can be done. But, it can be tricky to turn your knowledge and connections into a career path. This podcast will be especially informative for those folks currently in Capitol Hill contemplating your next move. We start out the second season of the acclaimed Steve's Rules podcast series with a fast paced discussion featuring McCormick group principals David Ris and Tim Horgan. Join Steve and his colleagues as they share lessons learned in this high stakes area of executive recruiting with a special deep dive for those coming out of government service from Capitol Hill and beyond. We take an insider look at what candidates can expect whether they are pursuing a position in-house, with an association or a multi client practice. Episode Notes: Email Steve and his guests: Steve Nelson snelson@tmg-dc.com David Ris dris@tmg-dc.com Tim Horgan thorgan@tmg-dc.com Article Referenced in Podcast: Building a Better Mousetrap: A Model for a Lawyer’s Business Plan Contact Steve McCormick GroupPlayPlay Listen to Top Executive Recruiters Share How to Turn Government Service Into a Career As a Government Relations Professional
• Episode 7 Season Finale: 2023 Wrap up with Steve and his Colleagues Saadia Sultan and Rob VergaDec 23, 2023 · 42 minSend us Fan Mail Well, here it is the 2023 season finale of Steve's Rules. In this very special episode we are joined by Steve's colleagues Saadia Sultan and Rob Verga who share insights from the 2023 lateral recruiting in market and their predictions for 2024. We end our podcast with some truly hard won observations about how firms and candidate's can impede their own efforts and some best practices as well. As always we welcome your thoughts and ideas about how we can improve our podcast. Please contact Steve or me Murray Coffey at any time. Thank you for listening and tune in next year for season II of Steve's Rules. Contact Steve McCormick GroupPlayPlay Episode 7 Season Finale: 2023 Wrap up with Steve and his Colleagues Saadia Sultan and Rob Verga
• Episode 6 of Steve's Rules- The difference between retained and contingency search and why it mattersNov 16, 2023 · 30 minSend us Fan Mail In this episode Steve provides some intel on the hottest lateral partner market (hint they call this city the Third Coast, and its the place Murray first drew breath.) Then we discuss contingency and retained search and relative merits of each approach based on your firm's profile and needs. Finally we hear a hunk from Steve's standup show. We packed a lot into 30 minutes. If you have any thoughts or ideas for future programs please feel free to contact Steve or Murray . Thank you as always for listening. Contact Steve McCormick GroupPlayPlay Episode 6 of Steve's Rules- The difference between retained and contingency search and why it matters
• Steve Addresses Some of the Landmines in Hiring Business ProfessionalsOct 17, 2023 · 30 minSend us Fan Mail Law firms need to hire business professionals as skilled and capable as the lawyers in their respective areas of focus. And yet, many firms still try to hire professional staff by relying on self-sourcing, agencies, or contingency recruiters. Steve explains why these results are often mixed at best. And what firms need to do to make sure they are recruiting the very best talent. Steve also shares his thoughts on some recent survey results regarding lateral partner financial performance. (Hint, multiples are not what they used to be if they ever really were.) Contact Steve McCormick GroupPlayPlay Steve Addresses Some of the Landmines in Hiring Business Professionals
• Steve throws out the bookSep 7, 2023 · 34 minSend us Fan Mail “What does the book look like?” is generally one of the first questions asked by a firm when evaluating a potential lateral partner candidate. But is this really the best way to evaluate a candidate? Firms and candidates spend considerable time completing and evaluating detailed lateral partner questioners. Yet, the portable business the lateral can (hopefully) deliver is often the overriding factor in considering whether a lateral candidate is the right person to bring into the firm. In this episode Steve challenges this idea and provides his thoughts on additional context and criteria firms should look to when evaluating a lateral candidate. And he schools Murray on some of the finer ethical points around the recruiting process. Steve also provides a quick update on the lateral recruiting market in Washington DC. (Hint, it has been active.) Contact Steve McCormick GroupPlayPlay Steve throws out the book
• The LPQ and youAug 11, 2023 · 26 minSend us Fan Mail This episode is a must listen for anyone involved in thelateral recruiting process, especially those in decision making roles. Steve’s Rules dives into the Lateral Partner Questionnaire (LPQ) which has become a cornerstone element of the recruiting process. As lateral recruiting has continued to gain prominence as an essential element of many firm’s growth objectives the need to accurately evaluate a potential partner’s likelihood of success becomes critical. And increasingly the LPQ is a cornerstone of the overall pre-hire diligence for most firms. Every firm has some form of LPQ it has evolved over the years. With such a bespoke approach there is no uniformityto fact gathering and candidates can often find themselves answering multiple LPQs if several firms are courting them. The process is repetitive and often fails to provide firms with the information needed to make the right decision on hiring a candidate. Recently the National Association of Legal Search Consultants has developed a uniform LPQ it believes will help firms better leverage best practices for the diligence element of lateral partner recruiting. Super recruiter Steve Nelson from McCormick Group has closely reviewed this new form and he has notes. We also discuss some of the intangibles that need to be considered that are simply not covered in any LPQ. Finally, Steve offers to email his own short form LPQ he has developed to any of our listeners who send him a request . As always, we welcome your input and are interested inhearing from you what topics you would like covered in further episodes of Steve’s Rules. Contact Steve McCormick GroupPlayPlay The LPQ and you
• Who are you...Episode two of Steve's Rules for presenting the most authentic view of your firm to potential lateral partner candidatesJun 26, 2023 · 25 minSend us Fan Mail For the second episode of Steve’s Rules, we dig into how a firm can make sure it is doing everything it can to attract the best and most appropriate lateral candidates. Hint: talk to your marketing department. This is a key episode for anyone involved in the day-to-day lateral recruiting efforts including Managing Partners, Directors of Legal Recruiting, and practice group heads. Steve also tells you what not to put in your lateral recruiting materials. And we open with a brief overview of the current lateral recruiting landscape. The big news on this front is more lateral activity is happening around groups and practices moving to new firms. Find out why Steve calls this the “gold standard.” To keep up with the latest news on the recruiting front please ask Steve to join his mailing list snelson@tmg-dc.com. Contact Steve McCormick GroupPlayPlay Who are you...Episode two of Steve's Rules for presenting the most authentic view of your firm to potential lateral partner candidates
• Welcome to Steve's Rules with legendary executive recruiter Steve Nelson from the McCormick Group-This episode...How and why to recruit high level government officials and lawyersMay 3, 2023 · 18 minSend us Fan Mail In this episode Steve Nelson walks the listener through the key considerations for both firms and candidates as they consider the intricacies of recruiting high level government officials from this or any presidential administration. For reasons Steve lays out in detail, now is the right time for firms looking to hire federal officials to jump into the mix. So to, for candidates, now is time to make the move if Andare thinking about making the jump. And for putative candidates, it is not as easy as picking up the phone and making a call to that managing partner you met at a conference. In fact, doing so may be to your detriment. Contact Steve McCormick GroupPlayPlay Welcome to Steve's Rules with legendary executive recruiter Steve Nelson from the McCormick Group-This episode...How and why to recruit high level government officials and lawyers